Approximate descriptors for front and back

Key for use: the adjective (front) modifies the noun (back). The noun describes what a person is, and the adjective describes their personality style.

For instance, T-front = “ingenopathic”, T-back = “altruist”, therefore a TT may be described as an “ingenopathic altruist”. It should be noted that a person’s back seems to derive from their particular species of limbic system, so a T-back can generally be expected to have the T-style amygdala, whereas T-front tells us nothing about the limbic system (except possibly orbit size).

T-front = ingenopathic (see Koanic’s definitions)
M-front = sociopathic (generally the intelligent, nonviolent sort, see the penultimate paragraph here, or the Gervais principle version, and split the difference)
C-front = psychopathic
N-front (negroid, sapiens) = impulsive (tending to act on the first instinct)
SC-front = Machiavellian

T-back = altruist
M-back = lawyer (as in “Jewlike”)
C-back = conformist
N-back = breeder
SC-back = savant


TT = “ingenopathic altruist”
MT = “ingenopathic lawyer”
TM = “sociopathic altruist”
MM = “sociopathic lawyer”
MC = “psychopathic lawyer”
TC = “psychopathic altruist”

I encourage you to make up your own descriptors, and let me know if you think of better ones. The focus is on group dynamics, rather than cognitive style (where I would prefer words like “empirical rationalist”).

About Aeoli Pera

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32 Responses to Approximate descriptors for front and back

  1. Edenist whackjob says:

    T-front: overlays, need to process through mental models. Rigid thinking, need paradigm shifts to move to next level. Interested in inanimate things.
    M-front: no overlays, high rate of sensory processing. Flexible thinking as a result. Interested in people.
    C-front: no overlays, dull processing. Interested in drama.

    T-back: systemizer, egalitarian, assumes everyone is basically 130+ IQ.
    M-back: man on a mission, desire to be cool, self-glorifier, non-egalitarian.
    C-back: automaton. YOLO and eternal high school.

    • Aeoli Pera says:

      Ditto all. Nice.

      >T-front: overlays, need to process through mental models.

      That’s a really good point. We generally don’t see what we aren’t looking for. This seems to be more the case in white matter-dominant brain states, which occurs more often in brains with a high ratio of white/gray.

      • Edenist whackjob says:

        For me, when I smoke weed, I really notice how much I am in my head normally. Think about it, if you have deep sockets your perception of the world is literally more in your cranium than a shallowsock person. It’s like being in a cave versus looking at things directly.

        Are you saying that T-fronts are more in System 1 (Kahnemann)?

        Recently I’ve been forcing myself to go into System 2 more. I wonder if this comes more naturally to Melons? Getting System 1 and System 2 to work together leads to higher intelligence, is my thinking.

        • Aeoli Pera says:

          >Think about it, if you have deep sockets your perception of the world is literally more in your cranium than a shallowsock person. It’s like being in a cave versus looking at things directly.

          I’ve also noticed this. It’s pretty funny.

          >Are you saying that T-fronts are more in System 1 (Kahnemann)?

          I haven’t read that one.

      • Edenist whackjob says:

        Since training System 2 more, it’s become clear to me that RSD is selling endless info-rabbitholes to aspies who are in the build-worldview phase of life.

        Their thoughts on hacking the social matrix are definitely worthwhile, but my thinking is that they have stumbled onto a cash cow and now they just can’t let it go. Hence the need to keep pumping out more and more videos which circle around the same topics endlessly.

        I still cannot determine whether their infields are faked, though, Have a nagging suspicion that they are so. Of course I could just go psychotic INTP and say “RSD are fakers and 911 was staged!” but trying to seek a more System 2 line of understanding these days so I can say it with confidence. Think that the next thing in my System 2 training will be to learn methods of reasoning under uncertainty (Venkatesh Rao, OODA).

        What a weird soliloquy. This place provokes those :)

        • Aeoli Pera says:

          I’ll take that as a high compliment.

          I only read Heartiste and Vox, so I’m not familiar with RSD. Pretty sure they do the formulaic stuff. Not a bad way to start off (I believe in training wheels), but it sounds expensive.

    • Aeoli Pera says:

      Sounds interesting, and I don’t even experience social anxiety anymore. Anxiety yes, and social failure yes, but social anxiety no.

      3 years ago I was a wreck, and this would probably help me understand what happened to change that (aside from BEEF).

      • Edenist whackjob says:

        Illuminatus is Eden-pilled. Seem to recall Koanic pegged him as TSc.

      • Mycroft Jones says:

        Wish I knew where Illuminatus got to. What he wrote made sense to me. I was/am sympatico to his view of reality. A mythology doesn’t have to be literally true to be very useful and beneficial. cf the work of Joseph Campbell.

      • Aeoli Pera says:

        He’s still around. This is his site:

        I wouldn’t like a mythology that isn’t true. The more true it is, the better. Still, there is something weird about the whole “myth” thing which is very loose with the particulars. I don’t know how to describe it yet because I’m new to this sort of thinking.

      • Mycroft Jones says:

        Aeoli, I think the best intro to mythological thinking is the book “The Lucifer Principle”, by Howard Bloom. I avoided it for years because hey, what Bible believer wants to read a book about “Lucifer”? But it wasn’t about that at all. It was about the ideas in peoples heads, how they get there, and the effects they have. Suddenly a lot of things made sense. You can probably get it from your local library at no cost. Very worthwhile read.

  2. Edenist whackjob says:

    C limbic system: switches easily between emotional states and has very little metacognition. Turns into a chimp on demand whereas the T-back can’t get pissed off if he tried.

    I suspect a lot of T social anxiety is dissonance between gutfeel K amygdala feelz saying “run away from this talking monkeys, they are like ticking bombs” vs the Kantian abstraction engine saying “everyone is decent and intelligent deep down”.

    • Aeoli Pera says:

      >C limbic system: switches easily between emotional states and has very little metacognition. Turns into a chimp on demand…

      Another really good observation. Even their emotions are psychopathic materialists, switched on and off to gain advantage, rather than as expression.

      “How dare you fail to replace my burger that I dropped because I’m an idiot!? I am disproportionately angry about this situation!”

      • Edenist whackjob says:

        Angry croms provoke a “fear of the unknown” in me. It’s like there is no data-type for them in the mind. Can’t be reasoned with, can’t be treated like rabid animals because Kant.

        Kind of like that hybrid dog Tex posted earlier.

        • Aeoli Pera says:

          That was me, silly.

          My response is analogous to settling into a wider, defensive stance, and waiting for the crom to decide what they’re going to do. It’s just kung fu- if you set your feet, you can apply as much force as you want. If they move forward, they are walking into the range of my front hand and providing extra power to boot.

          So that’s the analogy, but what it really comes down to is knowing where you stand on the important things, and sticking to your position. Ex: Do I really need this job? What am I willing to do in order to keep it?

  3. Craig says:

    Oppose I have a whole different system… :-D

  4. Edenist whackjob says:

    Psychotic data-dump incoming….

    Archetype words that came to me just now:

    TT – scientist, explorer, survivalist
    MT – crusader, priest, general
    TM – dazzler, vizier, hipster
    MM – pharaoh, prophet, venture capitalist

    Following types are more speculative, less crisp:

    Full SC[1] – magician, manifester, time traveller
    TC[2] (Thal back, cro front) – crime detective, bureaucrat
    CT (cro back, Thal front) – dim Thal[3], female porn star who joined up because of broken home and wanting acceptance (Thal back would not find it appealing on the limbic level)
    MC (melon back, cro front) – soldier with a cause, occultist
    CM (cro back, melon front) – lazy melon[4], actor
    CC (cro back, cro front) – average human (gracility (ie ability to do tricks and not shit the floor) is what gives the variation here, and determines caste system rank, but the common factor is always low processing + lack of direction)

    Here’s a way to think about the “flow of mental energy”, or how the “processing script” feeds the “life script” in each type:

    TT: matrix filter[6] -> connect the dots
    MT: matrix filter -> up toward The Cause
    TM: seeing things for what they are -> connect the dots
    MM: seeing things for that they are -> up toward The Cause

    Full SC: re-definition, “grokking the problem with this time-line” -> reality warp!
    TC: life is dirty and mean -> connect the dots
    CT: matrix filter -> meh
    MC: life is dirty and mean -> up toward The Cause
    CM: seeing things for what they are -> meh
    CC: life is dirty and mean -> meh

    Sexual ranks:

    TT: omega ghost or undefined misanthrope depending on brightness
    MT: sigma
    TM: gamma
    MM: alpha
    Full SC: sigma
    TC: delta
    CT: omega or delta
    MC: beta or gamma
    CM: r alpha
    CC: r alpha, beta or delta

    In two words:

    TT: seeker, spazz (ok, that’s two words because TTs are teh best)
    MT: stern
    TM: sneaky
    MM: charming
    Full SC: mysterious
    TC: mechanic
    CT: underachiever
    MC: sadist
    CM: bro
    CC: guy

    [1] I somehow find it hard to visualize this type as being divided into “front” and “back”, hence I will only list it as “full SC”. I see them more as “lateral”, if that makes sense. Would also make sense cranio-geographically[5] (ie temporal lobes go on the sides of the head). Possibly, SC is never even a full type, but rather an addition to an existing type. Ie one might be TM with a smattering of SC to give weird powers and odd levels of success.
    [2] Kevin Bacon might be an example of this type
    [3] This type can think logically/categorically but can’t fully Connect The Dots and build a worldview.
    [4] Sees Things For What They Are but doesn’t have a burning fire to change the world
    [5] Here’s a new term: “cranio-psycho-geography”. We already know about phrenology, but how does the self-perceived position of brain inputs and processing station affect cognitive style? So far we’ve identified the “being in your cranium” deepsock thing. Are there more of these? Embodied cognition is a thing, maybe we should study it, all scholar-like, as they say[7] on Less Wrong.
    [6] By this I mean always seeing an overlay super-imposed on reality, being in a cave of thoughts. Seeing an ideal reality beyond this one. Most of the time, not even being aware of this.

    Trying to improve my writeprint. Please tell me if it worked!

    • Heaviside says:

      Get rid of this Buddhist bullshit about “seeing things for what they are”. How can anyone still use phrases like that after the long travails of western philosophy? If you don’t have a “matrix” you can’t think. If you don’t have a flawed model of the world you can’t have self-consciousness. People who don’t have “matrices” aren’t self-conscious and are less than human, especially MMs.

      • Edenist whackjob says:

        That’s interesting. Care to elaborate, or point me in the right direction?

        Here I was assuming that I was crippled because of my heavy overlays, and that The Truth Is Out There.

        But OK, might it be worthwhile to say that melons have an easier time updating their matrix than Thals do?

      • Heaviside says:

        If the truth is defined as being “out there,” then how does it ever get “in here”?

        I don’t know if the melon/thal distinction makes much sense anymore. Some people don’t have “matrices” because they just don’t give a shit.

    • Edenist whackjob says:

      Maybe The Truth Is Out There has to be with intuitive, non-verbal understanding, so right brain. But that theory is not coherent since hardly every melon is a Zen buddhist.

      So, I think a better phrase might be “The Truth Is Up For Grabs”.

  5. Edenist whackjob says:

    Arrgh, teh typos again.

  6. Edenist whackjob says:

    Btw, yesterday’s weed trip told me the following crazy things:

    -Feminization of politics and people since WW2 is due to radiation from nuclear weapons (to be fair, I have read this before on the Internet, but it clicked this time). WW2 is also a massive psychic trauma, and trauma tends to make people depersonalized and in their head. Prior to WW2, Europeans were much more cro-maggy.

    -Satanic forces are pretty obviously at work in society. Just look at media, it’s always chock full of symbolism (the image I got was 80s metal bands – not saying that metal musicians are Satanists, but rather that creative people tune into whatever “is in the aether” at the time). The thing with conspiracy theorists (and I would count all Edenists into that camp) is that they can process those undercurrents going on, but they cannot make themselves fully believe it. “Satan’s greatest trick was making people believe he doesn’t exist” and all that. Maybe Satan == shadow forces that we can see but don’t acknowledge. But then why all the occult symbolism from the powers that be? For teh lulz?

    -Javascript is a hipster language and people have been seduced by its awesomeness, when it’s not really the case. I need to study real programming if I want to improve and become advanced.

    -Several bloggers I follow are liars and/or secretly gay. Won’t name names. Just little things clicking into place. I had seen those little things before, but never clicked the dots before. High intelligence people can be good lie-spotters if they just get rid of naivete and stop assuming egalitarianism.

    -If we visualize money as not abstract bits and bytes, but rather gold coins, socialism becomes a much less appealing thought. Mental images matter!

    • Heaviside says:

      >If we visualize money as not abstract bits and bytes, but rather gold coins, socialism becomes a much less appealing thought. Mental images matter!

      Fiat money is a genuine innovation, and the ability of banks to create money out of thin air is just a logical consequence of the very nature of money itself.

  7. Edenist whackjob says:

    That I-can-see-it-but-I-can’t-fully-believe-it thing I mention above should be a cue to immediately investigate more effort into that particular thing.

    Normal human: can’t see it, no need to believe. Conspiracy theorists are obviously crazy. A is A, crazy is crazy (not realizing that “crazy” is not a fact).

    Conspiracy theorist / Edenist: CAN see it, but can’t fully believe it. Sits around writing psychotic blogs and suppressing low-grade anxiety that something is wrong with the world.

    ???: sees it and believes it and investigates it. I think Tex reaches this sometimes.

    A typical failure mode is accumulating a ton of things one can see but can’t see fully working. This leads to some sort of half-belief, ie throwing out that “aliens are here on planet Earth” or “melons are the overlords” but then not doing the logical thing, which would be to dedicate one’s life to uncovering the truth about such matters, which if true would be some of history’s greatest discoveries. Instead, one reads Tim Ferriss (nothing against him, just trying to illustrate the mechanism of not thinking on the highest “mental pay-grades”).

    Another example: I know that Win Wenger has IQ-boosting methods, and I’ve even purchased his book[1]. But I just don’t have the full-belief that it will work, so I procrastinate. “Sucking on the caramel” of it-might-work is sweeter than actually exploring it. It’s a line of thinking that goes “that problem seems cool but it’s above my pay-grade so I will just keep it in my todo-list as a mental toy”. I suspect that a lot of high IQ comes down to having the instinct to pounce on those problems, instead. They can’t be that hard!

    Normal human: hurr durr.

    Typical manospherite: I can kind of believe that one can hack one’s life. How hard can it be? X years later: yeah, that worked out and I’m decently awesome.

    ???: I can kind of believe that I could make a significant discovery of world class. It can’t be that hard! X years later: yeah, I did. Too bad almost no one understands what I’m saying.


  8. Edenist whackjob says:

    Another observation: there is a lot of psychic stress in the Western world, between demographics, financial crises, media hype, office jobs, the threat of nuclear Armageddon, etc.

    This is one of those obvious yeah-I-can-see-it things. But really *click* it.

    What does constant psychic stress lead to in a population?

    For one, short term mating. Now, it’s commonly said that amygdala activation leads to K behavior. But I am talking about suppressed anxiety here.

    It’s like knowing a radioactive cloud will sweep in tomorrow, but fucking all night in a gleeful stupor until it happens. Anyone who points out the obvious is a joykiller.

    K behavior would make sense if there was a chance of escape from the anxiety. One then starts to think that such a constant level of psychic stress would be very useful for the elites.

    Think about it – when did you last meet a person who was capable of some degree of abstract processing, who WASN’T at least a bit anxious? This is why the 19th century seems so appealing to the NRX people: people were smart and not anxious. The Zeitgeist of today is decidedly Lovecraftian. Ie there is no hope, all you can do is to have some pretend-fun.

    The short term mating thing in and of itself is a psychic stressor. Think salmons who swim upstream to find a mate, or randy cats who stop eating during heat season because mating is so much more pressing. Then imagine that humans are animals, too, and that the constant pump-and-dump cycle at work in the West is actually the exact same thing.

    Man, getting a lot of stuff today…

    • Heaviside says:

      “Billions may die, we will win.”

      As technology advances, it becomes easier and easier for smaller and smaller groups of people to kill larger and larger groups of people. What’s necessary is for a small highly motivated vanguard to take the fate of the world into its own hands and use WMDs to overthrow TPTB.

  9. Edenist whackjob says:

    Seeing-and-believing explained by RSD Tyler:

    • Edenist whackjob says:

      Man, that was wordier than I remembered. This is the point:

      ‘Tyler of ( reveals the secret to where your beliefs come from. Rather than being objective, your mind “autodetects” how much brain power you have, and where there’s a “lane” that you could use it, and rationalizes what to focus on and what opinions you should have. Think of beliefs as a “vehicle” that you can upgrade any time.’

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